US is sterile ground for radicals
According to this article radicalism is finding the US Muslim community to be sterile ground, though some try very hard to convince Americans that 99% of US Muslims are desperately itching to perform an act of terror.
I think most everyone agrees that one of the main differences between European and American Muslims is that American Muslims are generally of a higher SES and do not form Muslim ghettos as they do in Europe. To the contrary, many of the largest Muslim clusters here in the US are in the suburbs (Here in N Virginia is a good example).
“What we have here among Muslim-Americans is a very conservative success ethic,” says John Zogby, president of Zogby International in Utica, N.Y., whose polling firm has surveyed the Muslim-American community. “People come to this country and they like it. They don’t view it as the belly of the beast. With very few exceptions, you don’t see the bitter enclaves that you have in Europe.”
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America, too, has poorer neighborhoods with large Muslim concentrations, but they tend to be interspersed with other ethnic groups and better assimilated into society. Another difference, some suggest, is the general profile of Muslims who have come to the US and raised their families here.
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Most Muslim immigrants came to America for educational or business opportunities and from educated, middle-class families in their home countries, according to an analysis by Peter Skerry of Boston College and the Brookings Institution. In Europe, the majority came to work in factory jobs and often from poorer areas at home
This is part of what makes the SES gap between Black American Muslims and immigrant Muslim groups so significant: Education. It is nearly unheard of for a second generation Desi Muslim to not go to college and get a good job. It is a cultural expectation.
Even when immigrant Muslim groups have little education, many of them have family businesses (often in poor neighborhoods) and make barrels of money.
“The culture is qualitatively different [in the American Muslim community] from what we’ve seen from public information from Europe, and that actually says very positive things about our society,” says Jonathan Winer, a terrorism expert in Washington. “We don’t have large populations of immigrants with a generation sitting around semi-employed and deeply frustrated. That’s a gigantic difference.”
Jaber, the AmeriCorps volunteer, who is studying to become a medical doctor, says he has not experienced anti-Muslim bias. In part, he says, that may be because he doesn’t have an accent or look particularly Middle Eastern - his father is Palestinian and his mother Filipino
As mentioned above, the number of different ethnic groups in the US makes a difference, but another thing, not mentioned in the article - and as Jaber demonstrates - is that interracial marriage is probably more frequent between Muslims here in the US than in Europe where 55% of British Pakistani Muslims are married to their cousin.
Conversely, cousin marriage is not only relatively rare here in the US amongst Muslims, but it is not strange - though still relatively rare - to see interracial marriage.
That being the case, the ethnic mix of Muslims in the US has a significant - though still relatively small - group of youngsters that are mixed race.
Just recently, I have seen children that were Somali/Chinese and Uzbek/Puerto Rican to go along with the white/Arab, white/Pakistani, black/Pakistani and an entire legion of black/Moroccan Arab children here in the DC area.
When people are making more money, establishing lives for their families, are generally more educated and have more marriage options, it is no surprise that it puts a damper on radicalism.
As for converts, I have mentioned before that although some of them may talk crazy, I don’t believe that the vast majority will act on it. This may be mainly because they have no major kharijee gang leaders here to recruit them.
Unlike the US, the UK had Kharijee gang leaders such as Faisal, Omar Bakri and Abu Hamza that distributed tapes and had followings in the UK. There were no such gang leaders here in the US to trick the lesser educated and semi-employed Black American Muslims who would probably have made up the bulk of such a following. So many of them instead found their way into other movements that may be socially damaging to them, but non-violent.
Then on top of that, even if some of them sympathized with an extremist group, not only is it unlikely that many of them could afford to take a trip overseas to get endoctrinated, but the vast majority are caught up into doing a little something known as surviving.
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Link: Radical Islam finds US ’sterile ground’
UPDATE: Research on US Muslims [pdf]
Some highlights:
- About 47 percent are ages 35-54.
- About 20 percent are ages 25-34.
- Sixty-two percent have obtained a bachelor’s degree or higher.
- About 50% are professionals.
- Forty-three percent have a household income of $50,000 or higher.
- Seventy-eight percent are married.
- Eighty-three percent have one or more children.
Filed under: Black American Muslims, Convert Issues
The new generation of mixed AmeriMuslims will be more open minded than their predessors and lets hope and pray that they also come into position of leadership in the Muslim community so that they can positively impact the rest of the community.
Also Eid Mubarak!
I really do think that you sometimes exaggerate about the lack of social mobility and success within the muslim communities within the UK. Without reference to data and statistics, it is patently obvious to anyone with a discerning eye that the Muslim communities of the Uk are not stagnant but by and large are flourishing in terms of politics, economics, commerce and social integration. As for the massive Pakistani and Bengali communities, we need to make a distinction. Yes, there is a significant number who are under educated (relative to the very high US standards) and socially separate. However, the terminology of Ghettoisation is completely misleading, because it’s connotations for an American, indicate far reaching, broad and outright downtrodden poverty and lack of choice-which is nonsense. Firstly, generally the cities where Muslims tend to live in the UK,London, Birminghm, Manchester, Sheffield, Leeds do NOT have ghettoes as understood by Americans, they’re simply neighbourhoods with a sizeable and visible Muslim population. Secondly, these neighbourhoods would tend to contain the VERY rich and the VERY poor, who more often than not tend to be family. The effect of this is that the successes of some family members are a cushion and support for the less successful family members. Often the less educated would be employed or assisted by a family member who is well off. Thirdly, In the US the typical means of income generation is via the mainstream i.e Professional careers-doctors, lawyers, engineers etc. In the UK, the Pakistanis and Bengalis tend to be entrepreneurs of many different sorts. Often the financial remuneration of a Professional career would not compensate working as an independant businessman. What is the point working as a Management Consultant earning $70k a year, when you could open a shop and earn $200K a year, purchase a few properties in a small city worth $100k each and rent them making $20K a year for each property (all the while the property might appreciate to $200k in 5 years) or even be a London taxi driver and earn $110K a year (with lots of overtime).Wallahi, I’m not exagerrating. Fourthly, this country does have a burgeoning visible professional class. It is also not that difficult to enter it. It usually simply requires one to have a College (UK-Uni) degree and pass a few interviews. The problem lies in the importance of education that is imparted to youngsters from parents. Often most parents are, as you stated, uneducated, so this effects their level of encouragement. But referring back to point 3 the enterprise opportunities are phenomenal so that even if you don’t get an education (which you can do at anytime because it is free/subsidised) it shouldn’t restrict you. Fifthly, in most parts of Britin, ‘white’ people tend not to be as isolationist as many parts of the USA, where racism is much more ingrained and part of the social fabric. Britain has prided itself on ‘multiculturalism’, thus ‘white’ Britain does not have a problem integrating and accepting immigrants as there social and cultural equals (politics and economics are different) or even marrying their daughters, hence the huge mixed race (usually afro caribbean/white) population here. Admittedly though, unfortunately, the type of first generation Muslim immigrants have tended to come from very exclusionist cultures i.e Kashmiris, Bengalis and Somalis. Thus, it has been the uneducated muslims who have generally decided to try and separate themselves from the wider society spatially and culturally. The second and third geneartions ARE changing this though. Having watched many programmes about Muslim Americans it does surprise me though that you have so many immigrant Muslims (not reverts) who are outwardly non-practising i.e few beards, hijabs, jilbabs, thawbs (relative to the UK). This might be another aspect that might be a cause of the imagined ’spatial’ difference between Muslims and Non-Muslims in the Uk, that does not occur as much in the US??? One of the aspects about ‘Europe’ let’s talk about the Uk though, is that the opportunities to progress are exceptional. There is FREE higher education, healthcare, subsidised good standard housing, good welfare payouts ( if needed-obviously many abuse this), media and da’wah opportunities that surpass The US e.g. Islam Channel-where is the US equivalent. Also ask yourself why have many scholars and du’aat chosen to reside or at least base themselves mainly in the UK in recent years e.g. Khalid Yasin, Amr Khalid, Abu Usaamah, Haitham Haddad, eg Imam Ramee sought political asylum here LOL-why not Canada or Jamaica or Mexico.
Thus, I conclude, 1) Distinguish the UK from ‘Europe’ as most Muslims from ‘Europe’ tend to want to come to the ‘uk’ due to its progresive and tolerant stance/environment
2) Don’t be fooled by the political jostling tht you read about in the Media. Soundbites by politicians, are completely distinct and separate to events on the ground eg recent Niqab media furore
3) Be aware that most of your posts about the US could be literally related to the societal issues in the UK. A good example is that of African American problems. The African Caribbeans (usu. Jamaicans) although a minority of Blacks in the Uk compared to West and East Africans ( due to recent immigration in the last 5-10 years) are the equivalent of AAs in the UK and undergo exactly the same issues/problems etc as the AAs in the deen and outside inc. the ‘Moroccan wife’ fixation, the Philadelphia type thug salafi situation, asking for sadaqah, black on black violence etc. Thus as brothers over the pond we have a lot in common. We both get demonised in the West, our symbols are not apparent, we struggle to maintain our identity, we have immigrant/revert divides THUS generally THE WEST is THE WEST. No MAJOR differences. I’ve been to the US and I feel there is more opportunity in the UK than in the US as a Muslim who is black though-BUT that’s just my subjective viewpoint.
4) Often, the stereotypes that seem to be demonstrated on many US blogs about the Uk which re based on reading headlines are way too generalised. The UK is a large place. The environment in West London for Muslims may differ ( and does differ) greatly to the environment for Muslims in South or East London for instance. That’s like saying Queens is exactly the same as Bronx or Staten Island. I’ve had culture shocks just going from one neighbourhood to another, let alone the big economic and social difference between Northern England and Southern England. It behoves me therefore to try to live in an area which is more to my liking. For instance, here in the Uk, if I CHOOSE to live in an All white Neighbourhood, unless that area is well known to have Neo-Nazi/KKK type problems (which is very rare) then Alhamdulillah, there’s no problem. (Mind U I prefer a balance of nationlities though) I don’t HAVE to live in the local Project (Uk-council estate) if I can afford not to. Also a local project 9/10 won’t be that bad. It’s only drawback is that I’m surrounded by broke people and a bit of crime. But we tend not to have projects like Queensbridge or Robert Taylor Homes.
5) Inshallah Tariq and Umar Lee, both of you should come to the UK approx. $400-600 air fare each, $ 200 hotel bill (3 star) for a week and $150 spending and experience it for yourself. If you’ve already been, then come again with the intention to critique your pre-existing viewpoints validity.
Londoner:
I would like to visit London, Insha Allah. I have met some very nice Muslims from there.
Just one problem:
You guys drive on the wrong side of the road
HaHa Tariq,
in subtle terms. I suggest you visit mosques such as East London Mosque, Regents Park Mosque (these are the 2 flagship masajid-both are Huge), Goodge street Mosque(Central london), Brixton Mosque and Lewisham Mosque ( to encounter ‘YOUR’ people LOL) to fit in. Inshallah I’ll leave it there. I greatly appreciate your blog and look forward to one coming from the UK soon inshallah.
Jezakalluahu Khayr for your magnanimous reply.
Well, generally London is like a less stressed out version of New York (which is too much for me). Thus you don’t need to drive, much less take a taxi. Buy an oyster (Swipe) card and use it on any of the different modes of transport-Bus, train and tube (the Subway). There are Muslims communities throughout London. The largest and most ‘ghettoised’ (for want of a better word) e.g. few 1st generationers speak decent english etc etc is in East London-I don’t like it and thus avoid it for this reason. It has mainly Bengalis and a sizeable minority of pakistanis and somalis. North London has mainly less practising Turks and Kurds, but is quite peaceful and quieter. Outskirt West London has huge financially upwardly mobile Pakistani and Indian communities, and big but struggling Somali communities. In fact there are parts of West London where there are NO visible white faces. Inner city west London has mainly Moroccan, Algerian and East african Muslims who are less well off. Also in Central west London there are pockets of rich Khaleeji arabs. South London has sizeable middle class professional pakistani communities, small but significantly known African caribbean revert populations who are VERY (philadelphia comes to mind) practising, many West African Muslims eg Sierra Leone and Nigeria and large separate pockets of Somalis. You’ll find that London is very much divided on the basis of ethnic groups i.e West africans, East africans, Arabs, Asians (in Uk Asians=Desis not Orientals) and groups-Ikhwaanis, Salafis, Hizb ut tahrir, takfiris, hanafis etc etc. As an African American don’t be surprised to be impliedly told to go to YOUR people (In the Uk this =’ African Caribbeans’
P.S. Get ready to drink tea instead of Coffee and to be called a Jamaican.
Tariq,
I spent a lot of time in London as I lived about an hour north. You get used to driving on the “wrong” side of the road. So much so that on my first trip to France I did the roundabout in the wrong direction!