Yeah … BUT
One of the most frustrating things that many American Muslims hear is that there has never been a single condemnation of 9/11 from Muslims. This mantra has been repeated again and again by those who are trying to dehumanize Muslims.
However, the person in the article below gives a good reason why many of these condemnations have not resonated. Many - not all - of them had some ridiculous justification attached to it. “We condemn terrorism, BUT…”
I stated before that this was not acceptable for other groups and there is no way that Muslims can expect this to be acceptable in our case.
The people who murdered Emmett Till thought they were defending the honor of a white woman. The people who murdered Medger Evers thought they were defending their culture. Does anyone try to justify what they did except they are seen as on the fringe?
How would it have looked had white civil rights workers said “Yeah, that was bad, but you have to understand that whites feel that their culture is threatened and we need to work on that”
Does anyone try to justify the actions or try to explain why a skinhead does what he does? No, and likewise no one is interested in knowing why 19 lunatics would fly planes into buildings or any other act of terror.
Again, this is not to say that Muslims should constantly apologize for actions we had nothing to do with, but when asked - which is almost inevitable - the condemnations should be unequivocal and not have a veiled justification attached.
Paul Barrett wrote about this in this article:
“What I want to know is: Why haven’t these American Muslims you write about denounced terrorism?” The speaker, wearing an expression of earnest frustration, stood first in line to get a signed copy of my new book after a reading I did last week at the Los Angeles Public Library. “You say there are these moderate Muslims,” he continued. “Why don’t we hear from them about terrorism?”
It’s a question I’ve heard at every bookstore, library, radio station and television studio where I’ve appeared around the country in the past month as I promoted my book “American Islam: The Struggle for the Soul of a Religion.” More than five years after the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, many Americans still want to know why they haven’t heard Muslims in the U.S. issue louder, clearer condemnations of terrorism. Muslim Americans who attend my readings often counter, sometimes with great emotion, that they have repeatedly denounced terrorism but that non-Muslims don’t listen.
But this disconnect may not stem entirely from a failure to listen. It may also have to do with the way American Muslims have condemned terrorism. Specifically, until recently, Muslim leaders often added caveats to their condemnations that robbed them of real force
The vast majority of Muslims I spoke with while researching my book were eager to deplore the killing of civilians for religious or ideological motives. Non-Muslims who insist they haven’t heard from moderate Muslims on the topic of terrorism simply haven’t paid attention to outspoken figures like Khaled Abou El Fadl.A scholar of Egyptian descent who teaches Islamic law at UCLA, Abou El Fadl takes an unambiguous stand opposing religiously motivated violence against innocents, no matter what the alleged justification
After 9/11, Abou El Fadl appeared frequently in the national media. He emphasized the restrictions the Quran placed on stealth attacks, rebellion and harm to noncombatants. He told the CBS Evening News in October 2003: “You cannot kill a woman, you cannot kill a child, you cannot kill a senior individual, you cannot kill a hermit, you cannot kill a member of the clergy, you cannot even kill peasants who are not fighters.” He emphasized that in modern terms, these prohibitions translate into a ban on all terrorism.
While he rejects the idea that moderate Muslims have been mute on terrorism, Abou El Fadl has argued that Muslim leaders in the U.S. have failed “to convince the American public of the outrage felt by most Muslims over the tragedy of September 11.”
[...]
That it took CAIR, ISNA and other national organizations until mid-2005 to clarify their antiterrorism stance, sifting out distracting qualifications, is disappointing and a partial explanation for why non-Muslim Americans claim they’ve heard only silence on the topic. The other part of the explanation is that we haven’t been listening closely enough to Muslims like Khaled Abou El Fadl, who have been unequivocally rejecting terrorism all along [Entire Article...]
Better late than never.
But on the dumb 9/11 conspiracies that some buy into…I’m sorry, but it just looks silly.
Speaking of which. Who REALLY destroyed the Death Star???
Filed under: The Culture of Denial and Pretense
I agree with you on one point and that is yes we should condemn terrorism unequivocally.
However, I disagree that:
-the main reason why our voices are not heard is because our condemnations are hedged within justifications. I think that has a lot to do with a lot of media bias. And I don’t need to prove that
-Secondly, the conspiracy theory thing has basis and you can’t deny that. And if you don’t agree with that, at least yu’d agree that the official story is replete with incoherence. Its mostly after 20 years that we see things like this on a documentary and by then half the people are either dead or don’t care anymore. So in conclusion, I don’t care if believing in what I believe to be the truth ‘looks silly’ or not.
Honestly, while we have to try our best to engage in the most effective way with Non-Muslims, we don’t need to be apologetic or get all peer pressured.
funny that you mention this. i was just listening to fiqh ad-dawah the past few days and muhammad alshareef mentioned this exact point. he said when you say “we condemn..but..” then the “but” nullifies everything coming before it. a better approach to say is “and” .. 911 was an injustice and terrorism AND so is….
The Muslim ‘leaders’ in the U.S have failed to convince the American public, that there is only one true god worthy of worship. What else do you expect? I for one do not start my dawah on defense mode and really I do not go the 911 route at all. From my experience the people who confront Muslims about 911 are just being antigonistic and I could condemn it/aplogise/beg for forgiveness till I’m blue in the face and they will still not feel that enough has been said and at the end of the day still be no closer to Islam than they were before.
Not to mention, who said that most Muslims were outraged? Many did not condone it, but weren’t outraged.
Burgundy’s media bias, I agree; lota’s “and” approach, a very good idea; Umm Adam’s antagonism theory, absolutely.
The antagonism theory is very close to what I believe in, which I call the Errol Morris theory of apologies, based on some comments Morris made about why he thinks people want Robert McNamara to “apologize” for his involvement in the Vietnam War. Essentially, Morris thinks that people want McNamara to apologize so they can reject the apology. I agree that we can apologize until we’re blue in the face; we’ll never have all the apologies Muslims have made to date accepted by the American public.
Which is why, as far as I’m concerned, the statute of limitations on making apologies expired long ago. Apologies and condemnations were made numerous times years ago. Don’t like that? Too bad. Get over it. Find someone else who’ll bow and scrape for you.
burgandy:
I don’t want to get into it, but I’ve looked at the conspiracy theories and when you think about certain things it doesn’t add up. There are many, but among them is that if the planes were actually missles, then what happened to the people? (They claim that they were in on the plot…including the children)
Lota:
I heard the series that you are talking about a couple of years ago and with all respect I did not agree with that tactic either as I felt that it was another form of trying to deflect from the topic. Going back to Emmett Till, how seriously do you think a white person would have been taken had he said regarding his murder: “I think it was bad and I condemn wolfwhistling as well”
Umm Adam:
These days, if you talk to a person about Islam for any length of time, they are going to ask you what you think about 9/11 or terror whether they are hostile or not. I have been asked about it several times even when talking about Islam and I am not asked again when I give a common sense answer by condemning it unequivocolly, passionately and harshly. I am outraged at the human tragedy and the fact that these deranged lunatics are giving Islam a horrible image.
I have noticed that people that are less than that in their condemnations are asked all kinds of follow up questions and the person may even get hostile once they get the feeling that the Muslim is giving them the run around.
There is no doubt that there are people that have agendas that would walk away from the most unequivacol condemnation and still say that all Muslims condone terrorism, but I have found many people to be very fair.
At the end of the day, from and Islamic point of view, we should not justify this evil
JD:
I’m not saying that we should apologize, but we should condemn acts done in the name of Islam Not once have I apologized nor have I been asked to do so. I have been asked to talk about it or explain to dispell misconceptions. If we do not give a voice to Islam, then the only voice people will hear is the ones from the video tapes on those insane rants from the caves
Conspiracy nutjob hate sites like Jihadwatch and LGF aside, most Americans really want to go on with their lives and live in peace and it gives comfort when we hear Muslims like Tariq and many others condemn Islamic extremism.
The extremists on both sides do not want us to see that there are Muslims such as Hamid Karzai and many many others that are fighting these Muslim extremists and want to push us into hating each other at all costs. Extremists on both side declare the other side to be irredemably evil. Neither side wants us to pay attention to the fact that there are many Muslims putting their lives on the line helping us to catch terrorists and serving with honor in the US military and other militaries around the world.
There are many people in America who are not Muslim that would not tolerate a mosque being defaced or burned and will stand by the Muslims for their right to worship as they please. This is the America that the Muslim extremists do not want Muslims to see. And the anti-Muslim nutjobs do not want non-Muslims to know about good Muslims.
Want proof? We all work together in peace and harmony everyday.
You need to keep in mind also that when moderate Muslims DO condemn terror the harshest critics of Islam just say “taqqiya”-Muslims are allowed to lie, and it falls and deaf ears.
Abu Sinan, remember that we have to put the fringe bigots that call all Muslims terrorists to the side and talk about mainstream Americans. Let’s not define the middle on either side by its fringe elements
Tariq, I have thought about this topic a lot. And one day, hopefully sooner than later, I’ll have to write up my contemplations. The gist of where I am on this goes like this: I believe there is a difference between the act and the circumstances that led to the act. So, for instance, if we find many pedophiles emanating from the same locality, though we will condemn them vigorously, at the same time, it is in the interest of the society as a whole to determine the causes of this locality’s anomalism in this regard. In other words, unequivocal condemnation does not necessarily preclude a discussion of the reasons that led to the criminal or immoral act. Not only does this discussion put the act in perspective without justifying it, but it allows the society to address the roots of the problem.
So, we may all agree and condemn suicide bombings that kill innocent Israeli civilians, but at the same time we have to be cognizant of the issues that force a human being to strap explosives on a body that is entrusted to him or her by Allah. Especially considering that they may not only be ending their lives on earth, but that they may be jeopardizing their hereafter as well.
I disagree that we haven’t condemned enough, rather we have been condemning, usually without the “ifs”, ad nauseam for some time now. There is no doubt that the media has a significant role in quelling these voices in lieu of more sensationalist sleeper cell stories. And there is also little that we hear in terms of condemnation from those who are associated (in religion, nationality or race) with the killings of Muslims around the globe. Here is a little more on what I wrote on this topic.
The link in my last comment messed up, Here it is again
Here is another entry in reference to an excellent editorial by a Rice University Professor that appeared in the Houston Chronicle: http://amadsden.blogspot.com/2007/01/jill-carroll-dishes-it-out-to-nay.html
Many American Muslims were also afraid of adding their voice because of then becoming visible for reprisals by redneck Americans. A few were killed just because they “looked” Muslim. And also, anyone who speaks out fears to be put on the FBI watch list. After so many were unjustly arrested after 9/11, I can hardly blame them.
Whether any American Muslim felt outrage is another matter. The shock and numbness of the attack were overwhelming if you lived in New York, and there was plenty of outrage to go around. Something like 60 Muslims died on 9/11 also, I believe.
This also can be seen as another way to use the race card. Along with all Southerners are racist, all poor blacks are dangerous and hate whites, all Christian fundamentalists are ignorant, and all Muslims secretly praised the mass murderers for striking a blow for …. what? Islam? no, Western pride? maybe, the feeling of Muslim inferiority against the modern West with its freedom and opportunity? again, maybe. It is all a race card, or a culture card, and we are being dealt a bad hand from a stacked deck.
Ya Haqq!
Salaam ‘Alaikum
I believe the # of Muslims who died was higher than that, but I can’t remember for sure now. What I do remember, when I think of that day, is the sound of the planes and the face of a man from the Jerrahi dergah, a man whose face literally lit up the place with his love for Allah subhannahu wa ta’ala while he was making dhikr, and how he had just arrived at his job in the North Tower that morning when the planes hit. And I remember how scared we were that people would come for us next.
I don’t know and I’m not sure if I care anymore exactly how ISCNAIRMASPAC word their condemnations. They don’t represent me. But it seems to me that whenever “something” happens that “they” want to hear us apologize for, I rarely see CAIR or ISCA or whoever they are quoted. Maybe in the paper, but not on the TV fast-food news, which is where more people get their “news” from. Every Muslim who has even remotely been involved with public activity has felt compelled to condemn just about everything in the last five years, but I think it’s getting to the point where a lot of us are saying, “Why am I being called upon, again and again, to distance myself from something done by people 10,000 miles away?” How many times do we have to say “We don’t agree with that?”
Also, I think that a lot of Muslims feel like people want to hear us grovel (not just condemn, they want to hear us beg for forgiveness), but they don’t want to hear about the impact of our foreign and economic policies overseas. I think that the “buts” have been more an attempt, however poorly executed, to explain why some Muslims overseas (and non Muslims, but why, oh why, don’t the MSM ever show our people the images of non-Muslims who were cheering and saying we “deserved” it??) **sympathize** or say “they deserved it,” even though they would not dream of carrying out some actions rather than trying to justify or explain about those 19 knuckleheads or anyone else.
Tariq wrote: “I’m not saying that we should apologize, but we should condemn acts done in the name of Islam.”
Regardless of whether we “apologize,” “denounce” or “condemn,” we are being asked to do it over and over and over and over again, even though the apologies, denunciations, and condemnations have been given Allah (swt) knows how many times. Our position on terrorism is well known; the ignorant do not bother to hear or read the denunciations, yet expect us to do it for them all one more time. Screw them.
Ed wrote: “Let’s not define the middle on either side by its fringe elements.”
We’re not, but what Abu Sinan wrote is true and does happen, even to yours truly. We can’t dismiss the fringe merely because they are small in number compared to the middle.
Our position on terrorism and a number of other issues (including even tawheed) is not well known. Saying “screw them” is not a good attitude to take towards those we want to hear the message
Peace be with you all.
Good post, interesting discussion.
No, the position of the decent people in the Muslim community is not well-known. Decent people (not just those in the Muslim community) are getting shouted down and intimidated by very well-funded and very militant extremists.
And, Mr. Nelson, the mantra is not just by those who wish to dehumanize Muslims, people who were also created in the image of our Creator. The mantra is by those who can’t hear your message over the noise from the extremists.
I will mention you all in my prayers this weekend. God bless you!
[...] Yeah … BUT « Tariq Nelson “Again, this is not to say that Muslims should constantly apologize for actions we had nothing to do with, but when asked - which is almost inevitable - the condemnations should be unequivocal and not have a veiled justification attached.” (tags: 9/11 islam) [...]
I’m not saying to ignore the fringes JD, but it is a mistake to think that all are like that. Those on the fringes are making money on this extreme polarization
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